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2 Motors On A Plane

Discussion in 'Scratchbuild Talk' started by DavePowers, Jan 8, 2010.

  1. DavePowers

    DavePowers Administrator

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    2 Motor on Your Plane (3:45) Topics Covered:
    - Option 1, the "Scott Lott" way is to use 2 motors, 2 ESCs, 1 battery, 1 receiver, 1 Y-connector, 1 receiver, and 1 Y-connector for the battery.
    - Option 2, the "Dave Powers" way is to just use 2 receivers, 2 motors, 2 ESCs, 2 batteries, and 2 receivers and just run them side by side. You are just putting "2 planes" worth of electronics inside your plane. Your transmitter will send a signal to BOTH of your receivers just fine.
    - There are a few different ways to run 2 motors, these are just the ones I use.
    [video=dailymotion;xbsiuy]http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xbsiuy_2-motors_webcam[/video]

    Attached Files:

  2. Dredogol

    Dredogol M0DERATOR - (aka "Dred")

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    Alright... goodies! :D

    Makes sense to me, but for the beginner, I HIGHLY suggest getting used to wiring / setting up with 1 Motor / ESC / BEC / Battery.

    Don't make your very first project with 2 Motors, because if you DO mess up, it won't be pretty.
  3. pghern

    pghern Rookie

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    Dave, Are you sure that two receivers can be "paired" to one controller on a DX6i ?? I though they had a unique signature and the controller will only "talk" to one receiver at a time??

    There is a third way to do it that is even simpler...
    Two motors from one (larger) ESC.
    http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=11636834&postcount=106

    Cheers, Peter
  4. DavePowers

    DavePowers Administrator

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    I do it all the time on my DX6, works just fine. I didn't think it would work for that same reason but I tried it anyways. Thats how I did it on my big SU-35 and X-36.
  5. weldblast

    weldblast Rookie

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    how to use two batteries without two receivers

    That makes lots of sense very easy to understand I'll try it after I'm done training on my wild hawk/simulator but Dave/Scott the only problem with that is you've got twice the draw from the battery and that means half the flight time so you can use two batteries and wire the battery to the ESC normally and use a Y connector to wire the batteries to the receiver and use a Y connector for the receiver to ESC so that way you have two batteries :D for twice the flight time:D
  6. RcFlyer50

    RcFlyer50 Rookie

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    Sounds pretty good to me Dave.
  7. Len2

    Len2 Rookie

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    You can also just Y connect two esc's into one reciever, and use two seperate batteries, one for each motor. I've found thats a fairly easy way..
  8. Ponydriver1974

    Ponydriver1974 Rookie

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    Dave

    Great Video but now i have some questions for you. 1) Would it be easier to use the y connector for the receiver but use two batteries instead? 2) I have heard from Scott that binding two receivers to the DX7 isnt possible due to model match yet I have heard that it is possible from others on this site. I an leaning toward what Scott said as truth because no one can give me a straight answer in regards to how to bind two receivers to a DX7 for one airplane. Maybe you can go a little into this process to lessen the confusion. Again great video and thanks for all you do.
  9. do-a-horizontal-barrel-roll-57

    do-a-horizontal-barrel-roll-57 Cadet

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    just a question can you do both and use one receiver with the splitter on the receiver side and 2 batteries when you think of it it should work unless you know different
    maybe you can do something else is you have a plane with a lot of controles like that wwii rc huge plane and use 2 recevers and 2 trannsmitters to controle a huge plane that needs lots of input like gunners and stuff for non flight controle stuff but run it all of of a huge battery but 1 of them is this also possible

  10. Foam and Tape

    Foam and Tape Cadet

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    why use two recivers? everything else in your setup looks good, I just can't see why you'd use two RX's? its just adding more weight (hardly) and also throwing more money in the air (no pun intended):D
  11. DavePowers

    DavePowers Administrator

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    Like I mentioned in the video, its nice to use that on super large planes with 10 or more servos. The voltage load from all those servos alone is alot for one receiver to deal with.
  12. Foam and Tape

    Foam and Tape Cadet

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    true, but it mostly depends on your ESC's BEC. If I was going with 10 or more servos I'd probibly grab one of the larger spektrum RX's.:)
  13. Jbirky

    Jbirky Airman

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    It worked for me, but I had to bind both receivers to the same model number. I.e. the DX 7 supports 20 different models with Model Match. Ideally, each model has a different model number, and if you select the wrong model you do NOT fly with the wrong settings preventing a crash.

    That said, it works with two DSM2 AR6110e receivers. I just tested it curious myself figuring it might very well work because it is the transmitters that store the Unique ID of the Radio not vice versa. I am sorry the video quality stinks. I will try to put more time at the end of future videos and get a camera, so I do not have to use my cellphone. Regardless, this video confirms it working with a DX7...


    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3QBSvpFxpqg"]YouTube- Spektrum Dual Receiver Test[/ame]
  14. DavePowers

    DavePowers Administrator

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    Exactly, thats why I use 2 receivers for the larger planes with lots of servos. I don't have to buy or make anything extra. Just slap them in and go. Time is usually my biggest factor here. Lots of different ways to do it depending on the plane, the goal, time, and budget.

    For example, on my big SU-35 I had (2) 40A ESCs, with extra heavy duty aftermarket BECs wired to them. (2) Mega Motors, (2) 2200 batts, and 10+ servos. I was forced to go with the 2 receivers because the plane would get more hot that usual because it would slow way down for high alpha and lose wind cooling. That is how I started doing this and it finally solved me overheating problems.

    If it was a normal jet flying through the air I could have gotten away with one receiver. But I just lose so much time when they always overheat from slowing them down I've now gotten to the point where I love to just over cool them at the cost of an extra half ounce or so. This way I don't have to worry at all about it over heating anywhere... which at that point the motors start to overheat and everything else stays cool, but thats another deal. :p

    So, a few different ways to do it, and the 2 receiver way works great for me in those unique situations.
  15. DavePowers

    DavePowers Administrator

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    Oh nice, and you don't have to unplug that center BEC wire on one of the ESCs I'd imagine. I might do this way on another twin I'm working on. The 150% Hydro I don't need tons of power but on jets it would be nice to have 2 batteries for more power. Saves me from buying one large battery that can take the higher C discharge of 2 jet motors screaming at the same time.
  16. DavePowers

    DavePowers Administrator

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    Jbirky,
    Do you know if the DX6i has that "one receiver per channel" deal to "prevent from choosing the wrong model from crashing" thing? Or is the DX6i like the DX6 where any receiver can work on any model number???
  17. Jbirky

    Jbirky Airman

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    The DX6i "should" be the same as the DX7 in that they both have ModelMatch. The difference is that the DX6i supports only 10 Models, where the DX7 can support up to 20.

    I do NOT own a DX6i, so I cannot verify it works, but my guess is that it would behave exactly the same as the DX7 and work provided 2 receivers are bound to the same Model Number.

    Here is the manual for the DX6i:
    http://www.spektrumrc.com/ProdInfo/Files/SPM6600_DX6i_Manual-LoRes.pdf

    Quote from Page 7:
    "With patented ModelMatch™ technology, you’ll never mistakenly attempt to fly your model using the wrong memory again. The DX6i features ModelMatch technology that prevents the operation of a model if the wrong model memory is selected. During binding, the receiver actually learns and remembers the specific model memory (1 of 10) that the transmitter is currently programmed to. Later, if the incorrect model is selected in the transmitter and the receiver is turned on, the model simply won’t operate, preventing a possible crash. Change programming to the matching model memory and you are set to fly."

    Here is the manual for the DX7:
    http://www.spektrumrc.com/ProdInfo/Files/SPM2710_DX7_Manual.pdf

    Similar Quote from Page 4:
    "With patented Model Match™ technology, you’ll never mistakenly try to fly your model using the wrong memory again. The DX7 features Model Match technology that prevents the operation of a model if the wrong model memory is selected. During binding, the receiver actually learns and remembers the specific model memory (1 of 20) that the transmitter is currently programmed to. Later, if the incorrect model is selected in the transmitter and the receiver is turned on, the model simply won’t operate preventing a possible crash. Change programming to the matching model memory and you are set to fly."

    I hope that helps. It "Should" work, but I cannot test or prove it.


    My understanding of ModelMatch is that it essentially makes your radio about 20 unique radios, where you just select the model and it recalls the settings and pretends to be a totally different, unique 2.4ghz radio. In theory, this should mean Model Match works with the AR6000, too, but II have no basis to be able to prove this speculation. In theory as far as the AR6000 is concerned each model number would be a different DX6 if my theory is correct. I wish I had the equipment to test this. The problem here is that I have only one AR6000, so I cannot test it. Since the receiver remembers the Unique ID of the radio and never transmits, it is reasonable to assume an AR6000 and an AR6110e could both be bound at the same time to the same Model Number and work together, but I have been told (probably by people that have never tested) that this does not work because one is DSM and one is DSM2. Does the radio really know if it is operating DSM or DSM2? More likely than not they are both more similar than Spektrum or JR care to admit, and it likely transmits both simotaneously, but again Horizon Hobby is probably not going to say being it is Patented...

    Really, if someone has a DX6i or DX7 and at least 2 AR6000 and 2 newer DSM2 receivers, it would be nice if they make a table of what works and does not.

    I may actually do a test and see if I can get a DSM and DSM2 receiver working together, or if an AR6100 and AR6110e can work together.
  18. DavePowers

    DavePowers Administrator

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    Wow, thanks Jbirky! Very good helpful info.

    Man, that "Model Match" has got to be an unbearable pain if you have one radio, 2 or so receivers, and a bunch of planes. When I go out to the field I usually got 4-6 planes to fly and film at a time with only 2 receivers to share between them all. Not a problem just swamping them from plane to plane at the field with the old DX6.

    I'll tell ya what happened; Horizon got their butts kicked from 50,000 people blaming them that their plane crashed cause the dopes forgot to check to see which plane they were flying.

    So Horizon comes out with their slick little "Model Match" racket to "help" the flyers. What it really does is save Horizon time and money from dealing with all the mad customers. This also "encourages" people to buy a receiver for each plane once they get so frustrated from having to re-bind a receiver to their plane at the field. So in the end Horizon makes alot more money from the increase in receiver sales and SAVES alot of money in not having to pay for all the costly customer support.
  19. Jbirky

    Jbirky Airman

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    Yes, that is exactly my take on it, too. :yes:

    You can still swap receivers among your planes, but it is twice the work at the field - not to mention that bind plug you left at home :bleh:

    Steps:

    1. Recall the Model Number that has the appropriate settings even though you do not have a receive belonging to that model number.
    2. Put a receiver in that model
    3. Rebind that receiver to the new model number (borrowing someone else's bind plug)

    If they are really mean, and I hope this is not the case re-binding would flush all settings from a particular model number restoring defaults... Now that would be truly insidious and painful. I do not know if they do they do that or not. Imagine loosing all of your delta-wing mixing, expo, dual-rates, servo-reversing and all that. I hope this is NOT the case, but I am going to test it.

    One suggestion for Spektrum... "You make tons of receivers continually revamping your designs seemingly for no reasons such as the new AR6110 to replace the AR6100 even though we cannot tell they difference. :rolleyes: How about adding a push 'bind' button, so we do not need the silly bind plug? and call it an AR6110b? for bind button or AR6110be for bind button & end pins, so we do not need to learn your new numbering scheme. :eek: Seriously, something small like this would be enough to appease and placate some of us"
  20. Tyrant1919

    Tyrant1919 Rookie

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    If having two receivers ment you could chose what channels were read by which, I'd be in heaven. (A six channel reciever would have a small switch to toggle between listening on channels 1-6 and 7-12)
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